#147 This week, my lovely guest is Kim Morrison with a conversation which centres mostly around self-love. Kim is a five times best-selling international award winning author, a facilitator and Health and Lifestyle Educator who in 1983, set a world record as the youngest female to run 100miles in less than 24 hours. Kim has lived an amazing life and has had her fair share of trauma. But what I found fascinating and highly motivating, was how she overcame those difficulties and fostered self-love instead of the scars.
In this episode we cover her story including why she lives by the ethos that success is 90% mental and 10% physical. So, if you have ever struggled with pushing yourself to accomplish something, or if you ever were overcome by the fear of failure, then this episode can surely be helpful to you.
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About Kim: Kim Morrison is an author, speaker, facilitator, and a health and lifestyle educator. In her own words, she helps people fall in love with themselves. Her journey and all she has accomplished to date has all stemmed from her unwavering self-belief and her deep understanding that you must also take care of yourself first and foremost. Kim set a world record as the youngest female to run 100miles in less than 24 hours in 1983. Cliff Young was her mentor throughout and still to this day lives by his ethos that success is 90% mental and 10% physical. She has used her running story as a direct metaphor for life – riding the highs, hitting the walls, pushing through the pain barriers, crossing the line and never, ever giving up!
Kim is well respected on the speaking circuit and has programs that focus on personality profiling and as well as leadership, teamwork and going the distance. Her personality profiling and teamwork programs provide incredible insight into how we all work with each other and provide real insights and strategies into working together better as a team. These strategies are also key when facilitation strategic and business planning sessions.
Key points with time stamp:
- Kim’s work in her own words (0:13)
- Where does Kim’s passion for self-love come from? (0:40)
- How did Kim transform trauma into self-love? (3:18)
- Why do humans suffer? (6:45)
- The role of determination in Kim’s life (10:27)
- The effects of pushing herself physically, on other parts of Kim’s life (22:52)
- Does the universe present challenges for us to grow? (27:47)
- What allowed Kim to look at challenges as opportunities for growth? (28:58)
- Looking at past traumas and challenges with gratitude (32:37)
- Describing self-love for men, and how they can explore it (36:25)
- How frameworks and awareness can help us overcome self-loathing (48:31)
- Kim’s morning routine (50:57)
- One thing about Kim most people don’t know (55:10)
- Kim’s choice of a dinner guest, from any timeframe (56:39)
- What Kim leaves us with (57:73)
Mentioned in this episode:
- Neuro-Linguistic Programming-NLP
- Dharma Shala
- 12th Kenting Tai Situpa
- Sanjay Rawal
- Sri Chinmoy
- Cliff Young
- Jack Johnson
- The Art of Self Love, Kim’s book
- Anthony Robbins
- Deepak Chopra
- Wayne Dyer
- Joe Dispenza
- Transcendental Meditation
- Anam Cara- Soul Friend
Kim Morrison’s Website:
Kim, welcome to the podcast.
Oh, thank you, guy. It’s such a privilege to be here.
Imagine we’re at an intimate dinner, dinner table full of strangers and you sit next to someone and they ask you, what do you do? What would you say?
It’s an interesting question, isn’t it? It’s very, I feel like I could say, you know, I’m an aroma therapist, I have a skincare company. I do podcasting I speak. But that’s not what I say. I say, I help people fall in love with themselves.
Beautiful. where does your passion for self love and falling in love come from? Because I’ve noticed the more I’ve looked into your work and what you speak about, it’s, it’s just oozing out of you. Like you, you, you live it, you breathe it, and you you are at as far as I’m concerned. So I’m always intrigued how and why that is the case.
I think I’ve always been really passionate and learning about human beings, how we take even from a little girl, I was always curious as to why my mum behaved that way or my my dad that when they split, I was happy when they split. And I guess if you want me to go quite personal, you know, I went through abuse and sexual abuse and court cases and and I was really curious, even at the age of nine, when all that was happening as to why that happened. And why did he do those things? And then I was really interested when my grandmother died at age nine as well. What Why did she die so young at 49. And I think I’ve just had that real curious mindset around. And when I found that she was really unhappy. I just thought, Well, what makes us tick, like, what is this and all through my life, I’ve loved people, always, no matter how hurt I’ve been, or how distraught I’ve been by what people have said, or maybe a fallout or argument or whatever it is, I’ve always thought there’s a way to heal. And there’s always a way where we can get back to what really matters. And that is believe in our true selves. And it’s fascinating because at school, you know, if you said to someone that they love themselves, they were kind of up themselves, it was like a negative. And yet, if I look at it, the one thing I want for my children, and for anyone that I love is to know that they do love themselves that they do care for who they are, and that they do know that they’re worthy. But it’s fascinated me Guy for so long, to really come to appreciate that not one of us escapes life without pain, or anguish, or hurt or suffering of some sort. And if that’s the case, the opposing force have that as love. And in all the books I’ve read, and all the authors I’ve listened to, and all the workshops I’ve done, there’s two opposing forces. One is love and one is fear. And each day, we have a choice in which place we sit. And it’s not what happens to us in life, but how we respond or react to it. That keeps showing up and giving us an opportunity to test it. And I think that’s where my passion for learning about it and knowing wholeheartedly that at the foundation of everything is the ability to love ourselves.
Wow. Now, you mentioned a couple of things. I had no idea about that such an early on to have something traumatic happen. How come? It helps define you to be self love when others you think it can happen that we carry those burdens heavily and never address them? Why was it different for you? Do you think yourself
For a start I think let’s be fair, the the guy that hurt me and abused me. And when my mom found out about it, of course, she was like a tiger. She was a lioness. And he was a butcher and threatened to cut off my hand with a big knife if I told anybody so I was you know, I was nine. So I was scared. But when my mom had heard, and it was because someone else had told her that he was doing this. And, you know, she took it to the courts. And so I guess I came away from that experience knowing they it’s I it wasn’t my fault it and I had someone protect even though I wasn’t protected, I was protected, if that makes sense. But I’ve also learned through life that it’s about the meaning we put into things and I’ve done a lot of personal growth workshops. And from the forum right through to psychology right through to landmark, you know, like NLP like I’ve done. So I am so passionate and interested in what makes us tick. That I guess it really comes down to the meaning that we put into it. And I’ve met people who have had terrible things happen to them yet. They’re full of love and like you say and others that have had something awful happened to them and it’s made them They hate me in or they hate life or they attract more. And that in itself is fascinating because it shows you we are attractors, what we put out there we attract. And the more we attract it, the more, maybe the universal lessons, maybe there are opportunities. Some would say, if you’re not on this personal growth journey, they would just say it was bad luck. Those of us that are more interested and inclined to believe in something bigger and the rent, the meaning of what we’re all here for, is that there are opportunities. And I’m not saying that in the throes of challenge. I’m sitting there going, Wow, I’m really glad this happened. And oh, wow, I’m going to learn from this and can’t wait to share this story. That’s not the case, when we’re in the throes of it. There is no doubt, it is agonizing. And it’s treacherous. And all of those things that we wouldn’t wish on anyone. But I also know that it’s through those struggles, challenges, and those treacherous times that as we crawl through them, as we choose to have helped through them. Or as we choose to grow through what we go through, then we come to a place of more compassion, more empathy, more love, if you really want to go that way more ability to forgive more understanding that humans make mistakes, more understanding that we’re all fallible, understanding that we are all on this quest to live our most fullest life. But it just depends at what level you’re at maybe on a soul level as to how far you really want to take it.
So…. So what I’m hearing is that context can be a good thing, the more context you have in some form of suffering, sometimes the more we’re going to appreciate the joy when we have it.
Well, I was in the… Some would say that’s so not fair. That’s so cruel, isn’t it? But I was in Dharma shala, I did a seven day retreat with His Holiness, the 12 Kenting tai situpa, who is the Tibetan Buddhist education, head of education of all Tibetan Buddhist monks, and I had a I got the privilege of being chosen to have a one on one with him. And as I sat with him, he asked me what my question was. And I said, Yes, I have a very big question for you. Why is it humans have to suffer? Why do we have to go through such dark times? Why do we all have to see tragedy in adversity? And he kind of chuckled he speaks better English than than the Dalai Lama. But He chuckled. And he said, Good question, my child. And he said, but how on earth? Could you ever understand light? If we did not have dark? How could you ever understand high without low? How can you ever understand your good side without appreciating your shadow side? And I really took that on in realizing that actually part of life, we can’t all be high all the time, we can also all be low all the time. And whenever I have the privilege of speaking, one of my first messages to those that are going through a tough time is this too shall pass, we know that it will pass you will get through if you choose to. And then I also turn around if someone was listening to this today, who’s in a good part of their life, and they’re, they’re on top of the world, and I’ve got a piece of advice for them as well. And that is this too shall pass. Nothing is static, nothing ever stays the same. And I think for me, personally, guy, the tragedies, the adversities, the challenges, have really made me come to believe in the power of the moment of now of knowing that right now is all that matters. Knowing that right here in this moment is all I’ve got, I can draw a line in the sand about my past, I can’t relive it, I can’t make it, undo it or recreate it. And I certainly can’t base my future, living in the past thinking worrying about something happening again, or concerned if it would happen or won’t happen, because that’s not me now. But if I sit here, right here right now and think I’m being interviewed by one of the podcasting world’s most extraordinary humans, and someone who I really value and really love and respect. I could sit here right now and feel completely humbled, it could almost bring me to tears when I think about it, because I followed you for a long time. And that’s the magic that I feel I’ve experienced through all of the things that I’ve been through and probably yet to come through is that the people that you attract into your life are there to teach you or open your heart in ways you never imagined. If you’re willing to be on that same journey.
Yeah, beautiful so well said, I think about on my journey way to what you were saying then there’s like, I’ve got to a point where I feel peaceful inside, if you like, and that allows me to be carry that with me wherever I go. Well, so we’re not Highs are high and the lows are lows. There’s almost like a development of self that is allowed me to be stronger and see things for what they are without having to layer the the emotions and the past experiences on top of something that can already be challenging or, or using the escapism of something high to to… Give me relief from the pain in certain moments, if that makes sense.
Yeah. Very much.
I’m curious about as well, because you do seem like somebody I might, I might be wrong here. But that loves a challenge. Like you seem to have a very strong determination about yourself. And how much do you think that plays into daily life and keeping your your soul sharp if you like, so when things do come along? And I was very curious, you only found out recently as well that you were you were doing ultra marathons? Am I correct in saying that, right. Now, that blows my mind because I had a guy a movie director on about 18 months ago, Sanjay Rawal.
I listened to that…
3100 camera and his mentor was Sri Chinmoy if I pronounced his name correctly, and it blew me away. What? I had no idea. I’m like, people do this, like this goes on. So I wondered if you could talk to that a little bit. What led you into it is does that lean into the things that we’ve already just covered? Around keeping your own soul sharp? Because to me, it just seems like she, hell.
You’re not wrong. I’m probably a competitive person. You know, I love sport. I’ll play netball to state level. And I love doing well at school as house captain, you know, strive to be I wasn’t the best at everything. But I certainly strive to give it my all and, and I don’t know why. But maybe my mom she had me at 17 you know, Mom and Dad split when I was nine went through all of that stuff with my grandmother and the, and the abuse and all of those things. And I became mom’s right hand person if you like, because she I’ve also got a younger brother and sister. And mum would work three jobs. And from the age of 10, I was cooking and cleaning and babysitting and bathing my brother and sister. And I guess it wouldn’t be allowed at all these days. But, but I just knew nothing else other than to rise to the challenge. This is what we have to do. And I put it down to my mum’s amazing faith in me to do that. And then when I finished school, I didn’t know what I wanted to do. And I went straight to university and I did six months of law school. And on the six month I was sitting there going, this so isn’t me, why don’t what am I doing here? This is not me. And I’d seen an ad that morning and the paper to work in a travel agency. And I thought that sounds way more entertaining and interesting. So I quit uni and went and worked and travel and I did travel for four years. And it was during that time I opened up my whole world into what’s out there and the different landscapes and people and color and tapestries of different cultures and things. And then at 19 I had won a trip to Perth, and I’ve been going out with a guy since I was 15 at high school and we just split up and I’d won a ticket to Perth. I was highly competitive. And you had to you know, put in a certain number of entries and I just wanted to go to Perth hadn’t been there before I was living in New Zealand. And my girlfriend and I won a first class ticket to Perth. And she said to me, there’s this really hot guy over there. I think you’ll really like him. He’s playing cricket for New Zealand. This will cheer you up and I went I’m not in the mood for a relationship. It’s just really no no don’t really need that. I’m 19 not looking for it. Anyway, we went to a cricket match never been to a cricket match in my life. And Danny walked out and was so hot and so gorgeous and hugged me and said hi. And in that moment, I decided I loved cricket and got to sort of hang out with Danny for a little bit and then fell head over heels in love with the sky in a matter of days. Ridiculous. flew back to New Zealand and then ended up quitting my job selling my car and meeting him in Melbourne on the Boxing Day Test match of 1987 in Melbourne took a one way ticket because I thought here’s my travel adventure. I’m going to go for this. So I met up with Danny and the New Zealand cricket team traveled with them for three weeks and then he returned to New Zealand. But I knew he was 21 and I was 19. I just knew I was really for him, but I knew he wasn’t really for me. And I remember sobbing on the phone to my mom. And she just said Oh sweetheart, you know, if you love something, set it free. If it comes back, it’s yours. If it doesn’t it never was and I knew I had to let him go and so forth. But now I’d spent all my money so I couldn’t go and meet my girlfriend in London on my big ice so I settled into Melbourne and there was a gymnasium that I was working in. I love fitness and health and right next to it was a natural therapies college. And I’ve always been fascinated by herds and plants and, and nature and things like this. And this 10 week aroma therapy course just caught my eye. I had $180 in my bank account, the course was $160. And I enrolled. And that 10 week course became three years of diplomas and certificates and it everything. Every time I learned something, I realized I didn’t know anything. And the more I learned, the more I realized I had no idea and so my aromatherapy diploma, I also went on and did a homeo Botanical therapy course, my fitness leadership became a personal trainer. And it was during my sports massage diploma that I had to get up my community hours, and I had to get up 200 hours in the sporting community and I thought, What’s the quickest way to do this? And I was told to go to an ultra marathon event. So I turned up in Melbourne in Coburg colic, and it was a 24 hour race and I was assigned to a guy called Cliff young It was a Sri Chinmoy race. And I was assigned to assign to a guy called Cliff young who won the inaugural Sydney to Melbourne race at 68 years of age. And he was known as cliffy, the shuffler, the potato farmer. And he kind of intrigued me. And He then said to me in the pitstop team one day, what do you think of ultras? And I said, fluffy. It’s the most boring thing I’ve ever been to You’re watching 40 athletes run around a 400 meter track for 24 hours, I can think of way better things to do. And he said, Why don’t you put your money where your mouth is and run one. And I thought I’d much rather run one than watch one. So I went over to the let’s lead scoring team, and the next race coming up was a 12 hour race. And it was about three or four weeks away, and I thought why not? So I entered this race and cliffy came up to me at the big Yes.
How many laps?
It’s a 400 meter track. So you’ve got 12 hours to run as many laps as you can.
Oh, wow. Oh, yeah.
So that’s and they score every lap. And yeah, I turned up at this race. I’d never run beyond 10 K’s in my life. And it was a Sri Chinmoy race. So this then I started researching a little bit about treach. And we know we didn’t have Google back then it was I went to the library and realized he was quite an extraordinary human. And anyway, Cliffy came up to me at the beginning of that race and said, I’ve just got one piece of advice for you. It’s 90% mental and 10%. Physical, and I thought at 20. Yep, yep. Yep, got it. And took off. And I ran, you know, through the first four hours and did my marathon and, and then all of a sudden, this voice appeared in my head. And it was, what are you doing? You got eight hours to go, it hurts. This is stupid. So I quit. And I went into the pitstop tent, and I broke down and see I can’t do it. And cliffy just came in and tapped his head and pushed his heart and said, I told you, this is a mental game, not a physical game. And all the Sri Chinmoy, people are out there, and they’re all cheering in these quotes everywhere. And one of the other quotes was the race is not always to the Swift, but to those that keep on running. And I’ve never forgotten that. It’s not about being the fastest. It’s about the one that doesn’t give up. And maybe it’s my competitive nature, I don’t know. But Cliffy also said to me, you’re better off putting one foot in front of the other than sitting here getting cold. So if nothing else, while you’re thinking of quitting the race, get back out on the track and walk it you don’t have to run it, just walk it. And then about half an hour later, that voice wasn’t there. And then I was feeling better. And I was jogging again. And and then it happened about eight times I quit Guy, and I just hated it hated every minute. I got blisters the size all over the my feet. I had chafing, but cliffy just kept saying it’s it’s the mind game. It’s a mind game. Anyway, about two hours to go, one of the lead scorers came up to me and she said, Do you realize you could win this? You’re actually you know, you’re not far from the front. And I don’t know something clicked in me and thought shit I haven’t come this far to now not win it, so apprently I ran the last two hours of that race than I ran the first two hours. I don’t know where it came from. I don’t know what happened. It was just a desire to finish the race and do it well, because I knew I’d never do it again. So I did win the race. I ran 95.4 kilometers. And when they gave me my trophy, they handed it to me. And they said, because you’ve run so well, you’ve won a place to represent Victoria in the 24 hour championships. So now everyone’s clapping and cheering and they’re saying, now I’m in my head all I can think I was now going to do that twice as long. And it’s in six months time. But this time, I trained a bit more for it. And I thought why not? Never I’ve never been awake. Yeah, so I trained for it. And six months later, I was in a 24 hour race. And that was another big story, which I ended up going on to win. And when I sit I set a world record in that races
so casually. Oh, you know, that’s massive.
I know. I know. It was, it was huge. And again, it was that this is where I really learned The power of the mind, you know, and I have learned since then one of the greatest ways to test yourself is physically. Because physically when you get exhausted when you if you ever do personal growth workshops, it’s all about pushing you to the brink of exhaustion because that’s your true essence comes out. Or when you are in labor, you get so pushed in giving birth, and then all of a sudden, the opposing contrasting feeling of unbelievable love and joy when that baby is put on your brace. Or, you know, you can go through relationship heartaches and break ups. And then on the day of your wedding, you just realize that all of those people lead you to this extraordinary human. And, you know, there’s, there’s always a beautiful way of looking at how we go through each of these moments in life. If you ever take the time, to look at yourself, and to be curious about your emotions and why you say the things you do and why you behave the way you do. And when you’re in the middle of a 400 meter track by yourself with nothing else, but your own thoughts you do think about that a lot. And all I kept thinking at one point was I wonder how far I can push myself in one cycle of the sun. And I just kept pushing and pushing and then again in the morning as the sun was coming up, there’s a graveyard shift between midnight and 6am. And I really did struggle through that time. But I stayed out on the track. I just kept walking through that time. And I think that’s what helped me win the race was that I didn’t everyone else was going into the pitstop team. I just stayed on the track all times. Yeah, most of the time. Most of the time, if
Did you have a nap or anything?
or no naps, no naps, but certainly came in and got dressings changed on my blisters and change shoes and clothes and things like that and a bit of something but never slept on a 24 hour race. And then yeah, they announced that I’d won that and ran 168.5 kilometers, which is 102 miles. And all I could think of was I’d spent four hours off the track complaining, winching eating strapping messaging. And then I thought, what could I have done if I hadn’t been winching? And then when they handed me my trophy, they said, You’ve not only set a world record, but you’ve won a place to represent Australia, at the world indoor 24 championships in London. And now my dream of being a netball of New Zealand had become a runner for Australia. And my passion to travel means that now is about to go to London where I’d never been before. So it was interesting, my desire to get my log out, turned me into an athlete. And I ended up running for Australia and set eight indoor records when I was in Melbourne, in London, and yeah, but I ran for two years. And then after that, it was like, I think I’ve done enough, I think, yeah, it didn’t drive me to want to go and do six day events or that 3100 are there, there’s always a part of me that kind of would like to, but I haven’t.
Alright, that’s incredible. How much do you think then put yourself through those physical extremes, because they are physical extremes is you know, that’s that’s, I’ve not put myself or anything like that, really, even though I do challenge myself, you know, but I must you think that has set you up in other areas of your life by not resting on your laurels, because it’s human nature to avoid discomfort. I mean, we so easily do it.
I think the reward means so much to me. And it’s not the reward of winning, it’s the reward of completing something. It’s the reward of seeing something through it’s the reward of knowing that I didn’t give up on myself, or the situation. And I probably am a very strongly driven person like that. And I believe we humans can get through anything. I truly believe that I believe in everybody to do it. It’s just whether or not you choose to do it. And some of us can choose to sit in the wallowing of the pity of the destruction of that. And some of us can choose to use it as a platform to become a bigger, better version of ourselves. And it was cliffie and my coach saying that running and putting yourself through these extremes actually makes you a better human. And I think that’s where I took that on. You know, there was a moment there was one day I had arrived at university and I was late and I pulled up outside my my classroom and my car I went to park my v dub, my Badal and I was in such a rush that the bumper hooked on to the tow bar of the car in front I was trying to get into a tight car pack and I freaked and I got out of the car and was so panicked and full of adrenaline. I literally lifted the car up off the tober and then got in the car and pulled the handbrake on and went into class. Now all my students were sitting in a classroom under the ground but the window was at street level so they actually all saw me do that. And I came into classroom set and hustle and bustle didn’t think anything of it and sat down and everyone clapped and someone did the bionic woman sound did you do to do it? You know And I was like, what, and they all went, you just lifted a car. And I thought wasn’t anything great until we went out on the break, and I tried to lift the car again, I couldn’t even budget. That’s when I realized that it’s an extreme. If you’ve heard of mothers or fathers lifting cars off kids, or, you know, people climbing to the top of a mountain, or doing something for their brother or sister who’s ill, or, like, you just nobody knows their true potential, until you are challenged. And that’s why even as a personal trainer, I knew when I try, I know even to this day, when I trained myself, and I think I’m pushing myself to a level 10 being my max, when I get a personal trainer, or a coach and all that bullshit, my 10 is a six compared to having a personal trainer, which is why I believe in coaches, mentors, and there’s always amazing personal growth, workshops, spirituality, things that test us and push us beyond the realm of what we think because remembering back to what I said at the beginning, we all put meaning into our lives. And that meaning is based on our beliefs, perceptions, values at parents, our experiences, but it’s not true. Just as my mother taught me to grow up and believe that I was amazing, because I helped do so much and I could do anything. And other children have been told by their parents, they’re useless Now, which one? Neither is right or wrong. But I just chose to believe that I was extraordinary. And yeah, maybe my mom’s struggles of her life made me believe I was invincible on to a level. I don’t say that with a guy say that proudly that I believe in a human can do anything.
Yeah, I hear you. You know, it reminds me there’s a line in a jack Johnson song. I think it was on the Curious George album. And he says, nobody ever told me not to try. And and for whatever reason that’s just stuck in my head from from the moment I hear that, and I often think about that as like, well, what if I didn’t even think that I couldn’t do it? So what would happen, you know, and just just move forward like that,
you know, cliffy, won the inaugural Sydney to belvin race at 68 years of age. I remember watching him cross the finish line. And he was dazed, he looked terrible. I mean, you can imagine running for 10 or 12 days, whatever it was. And they said to him cliffy, how did you do it? You’ve beaten all the field that are half your age? Why didn’t you stop and rest and stay in hotels like the others? Do? You know, he said, I didn’t realize I could. So that’s stuck in my mind. What if I didn’t know? I couldn’t finish a 24 hour race? What if I didn’t know I could climb Mount Everest? What if I didn’t know I could give birth? What if I didn’t know? I could start a podcast? What if I didn’t know I could start a business? If you if you didn’t know failure was an option. You’d never think about not giving it a go. So that line is so poignant.
Yeah. Wow. That’s amazing. That’s amazing. Do you think just before I switch topics, change gears here, do you think the universe presents challenges for us? For us to grow?
Yes. I mean, or not. I’ve done so much mind stuff lately. I’m like, oh, it could be it might not be it. It is what it is. It’s up to you whether you choose to put the meaning into that to do that. But I have chosen to look at it that way. I’ve chosen that look in the throes of it when I thought my marriage was over. We lost all our money. In the 2008 you know, collapse. I thought my marriage was done. My other grandmother had just passed away and was trying to launch a business. I honestly was lying in my bathroom floor going you are freaking kidding me. This is and my girlfriend turned around to me she Kim you got to get out you got to get up your kids need you you know this and itune receive what if this is a sign from the universe to say give up? And she looked me dead in the eye and said or what if this the universe asking you how bad do you want it? And so I could throw any reason or excuse at you. I can promise you there’s an opposing inspirational thought to go with it. It’s just whether or not you choose to see it.
Okay, let me stop you there for a second. You just said you lost all your money, your marriage broke down. And in the 2008 crash like like so flippantly is like, That’s huge. So what allowed you then to tap into the fact that you believe that this is an opportunity to grow in that challenge? At that point? How did you draw
I didn’t in the moment, I didn’t in the throes of it lying on my floor. I didn’t you know, my life wasn’t nice at that point. And I just didn’t know who the hell I was what it was about. And that’s probably the one time in my life where I could possibly have understood what depression looked like. I’m not a depressing type. I’m not someone who’s ever suffered with depression. But in that moment, I it to me, it was like there was no hope. I did have two children though that to kind of keep me going and I did have a husband that still loved me and I did have a business I was about to launch and it was when my girlfriend said you Maybe it’s the universe asking you how bad do you want it that I thought, shit, I’m just in the graveyard shift of another marathon, that’s all. So to me, my ultra marathons have become an extraordinary metaphor for life, we all are in the ultra marathon of life. And some of us right now are in the graveyard shift where it’s tough, it hurts, we want to quit, it’s dark, it’s cold, we feel alone, we don’t think we belong, we don’t think we’re good enough. That’s what I call the graveyard shift. And that can come in all forms, it could be, you know, being attacked, it could be losing money, it could be not being able to buy a house a relationship right down at the death of someone you love the, you know, there’s a multitude of ways we can look at what those challenges are. And it could be just a horrible comment on social media, I’m not suggesting any one of them is better or worse than the other, but they’re all there, right. And that’s a graveyard shift. But like I said, before, this too shall pass the sun does come up, you do get energy you can breathe. And to me, it’s in those moments, and I really heard this with you with the the, the the ice bath that we did, and the three or two or three hours that we did in the breathing, you know, sometimes it’s just a case of breath, by breath, moment by moment, I’ve now just got through that. And there’s another breath. And sometimes it’s just a case of counting the breaths to know that you’re still alive, that you’re still here. And sometimes bringing it right back to the breath, which is why I was so challenged with the ice bath. But then hearing your voice and the power of what breath is reminded me of all those other challenges I’ve had, and to breathe through it, and actually makes me feel quite emotional thinking about it. Because you may not appreciate how much that that that bath meant to me because I really didn’t think I could do it. And yet people would say, but you’ve run for 24 hours, but I was frightened of I don’t know what it was, I didn’t know if I could do it. And certainly being a presenter and a facilitator, you feel like you can’t fail even more, because people are looking at you. And yet, when you came up beside me and your voice, and this is probably the power of having a mentor or a coach, or someone who believes in you or knows that there’s always another side, which is why I think it’s so important we get therapy or help or people outside of our sphere. Because they know what we don’t know sometimes when we’re in the throes of that. And that belief. Having someone believe in you when you’ve lost belief in yourself is one of the greatest gifts. And I know that that’s now one of my greatest gifts is to help other people believe in themselves when they feel like the lights gone out.
Yeah, beautiful. Beautiful did do you think was it gonna say I’ve got your book here, the art of self love. Okay. And one, one thing that’s clear to me is your compassion, and the your heart that you put into helping other people. And with these experiences that you’ve had, are you able to look at them now with gratitude as a blessing that helped shape you even though you got the scars on your back, to go through those moments that helped shape you to be the person you are today.
I agree wholeheartedly. And I truly believe that I have been through those experiences, those particular experiences. So that when I stand on stage, or when I speak in a podcast, or when I write a book, I speak from a place of truly knowing that feeling. And I don’t put hearsay toward and I don’t minimize it and I don’t minimize your pain. But I am also very strong in believing that you can live below the line on this and make excuses and blame and gone to denial about what’s happened in your life. Or you can draw a line in the sand to be accountable, responsible and take ownership for that. And then decide who you’re going to be in this moment. So I guess also to there’s a part of me that’s incredibly and I appreciate your words compassionate and and I do love all people. But I’m also not about resting on your laurels or giving up or or you know giving in to something, I will take you on a ride if you if I’ve ever mean I mentor people and I have a mentorship program and I will take you on that ride. And I will listen to you but I will not allow you to live in your story. That’s not no that’s not true. I will coach or support you to not live in your story. It’s not up to me whether or not you’re doing and but I will show you a way if you’re willing to listen to it. And if not, then I’m not your coach. That’s all I’m just not your person. And we’re not all for all people. But all all humans have all traits. So we know that all of us can be below the line all of us can be amazing and above the line. So I think it’s about having compassion for one another that sometimes we’re in the graveyard shift of life and sometimes we’re in the twilight and some of us are in the finish line of one event and we’re about to start another one. You know, becoming a parent is a great finish line for the Pregnancy, but it’s a great starting line for the next adventure, you know. So I have found sport to be hugely satisfying for me and I married I ended up marrying that guy, the cricketer. And we went our separate ways for three years, but I didn’t marry him. And when he woke up to the fact that I was the right one, but he was a cricketer. So we’ve also I’ve really appreciated being the partner of an elite athlete, and supporting him through his life and bit getting to the top of his career and being a representative of New Zealand cricket for 10 years. And we’ve got two children that are highly aspiring athletes. I’ve got a daughter who’s a dancer who is you know, she’s she’s aspiring to be the top level dancer, and I’ve got a son who wants to play professional rugby. So yeah, it’s it’s kind of cool that they’ve got parents that have that don’t, I don’t put pressure on them to be there. But I will always say them. You don’t want to leave the track not knowing that you haven’t given it everything. Don’t go to your grave, not thinking you haven’t given it all. Is that really everything you’ve got? Is that really who you truly are? Is that really all that you think’s in the tank, because I believe there’s more. And, and I also agree with what you were saying were more, sometimes less those breaths, those moments, the solitude, the quiet times are just as potent and powerful, as the big times to
totally, totally thank you for sharing I am, I want to touch on your book for a moment, the art of self love. And I often think about this topic as coming from a male perspective, right? Because I’m sure as a male and a female, we, when we hear the word self love, we see it very differently. And for me, there was a lot of resistance around that. And for any men listening to this podcast right now, how would you describe this, and why we should explore it?
Well, I wrote this book because of my 16 year old son, and my husband. So I’ll tell you that this was written because of me and my life. So my 16 year old son was going through a tough time. And I’m sure anyone listening to this when you love someone and you watch them go through self loathing, not liking themselves. hating on themselves hating life, we also lost Danny’s sister to suicide. So I’m very conscious of where our minds go and what you know that that some people can get to such a dark place that that seems the only option. Or there’s a psychotic episode that can take someone to a place that creates an outcome that obviously, none of us want. So when my son was showing the signs, I was devastated. This is past the time when my husband had also gone through it because heading having lost his sister, he was also for want of a better word thrown onto the junky pub life with sports. So here he was at 32, a top cricketer and all of a sudden not wanted anymore. So I don’t know if anyone can imagine hearing 110,000 people chanting your name at the MCG to them now, who are you without your sport? Who are you? When you have no other qualifications, so my husband then grappled for years as to who he was, and who was he without being a cricketer, he dedicated his whole life to New Zealand cricket. So has Sam slow spiral into his own self loathing led us to our relationship breaking down and him going through a world of anguish. At the same time, we lost all our money in an in the financial crisis. And they all had at the same time, and it was massive. And I can understand when I come up time, you know, for want of a better word, a 50,000 view point, looking down on my life, I could see why my husband broke. And I could see why he went into a world of alcohol and drugs and self loathing. And he was away from me seven, eight months of the year, because it was now a cricket commentator. And he allows me to share this story. But he went into a white major world of depression. And all the psychologists had said to me is make sure your antennas up, because once there’s suicide in the family, it can sometimes mean this permission for others to do the same. And I never knew this stuff I didn’t understand. None of us are psychologists, and I was so worried about my family and Danny’s mom and children, the children of her like it was just, it was huge. So I went into protection mode. And that’s when we moved over here to Australia. And I remember sitting there thinking, How do I help my son who’s now now and fast forwarding another couple of years where we did get through it with my husband, and we did slowly crawl out of that with a lot of counseling and therapy and, and there’s other things I can share with that with you later. But now I’m looking at my 16 year old son and I’ve been trying for months to talk to him, but we all know that when someone’s struggling, they’re not going to hear it until they’re ready. To hear it. And my counselor had said to me about Danny, sometimes people have to hit rock bottom with both feet so that they can push themselves back up. So I had to watch and allow my son to hit rock bottom. And my desperation as a mom was to actually get in there and help him but I couldn’t. And there’s nothing I said or did was helping them. Until this particular night, he appeared on the end of my beard and just said, Ma’am, and I don’t know if I can swear, but I’ll tell you exactly what he sees. My life’s fact, I hate myself, and I don’t want to be here. Now Danny was home and lying in bed next to me. It was nine o’clock at night. Jacob was 16 his 17 year old sister appeared on the end of the bed. All four of us was sitting on our bed. And I just looked at him and I said, I haven’t got an answer for you. But for three years, I’ve been researching something, and I want to share it with you. And he goes, yep. So I pulled out my big A3 journal, A3 where I had transcribed all Anthony Robbins talks, Oprah, Deepak Chopra, Wayne Dyer, Joe Dispenza, I had spent so much time listening to all these gurus and transcribing their messages of hope and belief and self worth and all of these things. And being an athlete, I tried to come up with a plan on how when you fall out of love with yourself, or into a world of self sabotage or self loathing, what’s the pathway back because as an athlete, if you give me the steps, I’ll do it, but tell me to do it with my mind. It’s kind of challenging. But that was it for me. So I draw a big heart in the middle of the page, and I wrote the word self love. And I said to Jacob, sometimes the opposing thing to self love is fear. Or, you know, how you’re feeling right? Now, how is that and he said, hate myself. Lice fact, hate the teachers. Not good enough self worth less, just 16 year old boy language, he used that. And I wrote it all down under the word fear. And then I said, but the way back to yourself the way back to self love the way to back to believing yourself is a process. And the first step and I drew, step one was awareness, self awareness, you have to be aware that you’re in a bad place. Just being aware that life sucks right now means that you are loving yourself, because you’re aware that life’s not great, you’re actually taking ownership, that life’s not great right now. And he went, yeah, and I spent the next steps really important. And that’s self care, you have to do something nice for yourself. When you’re in the throes of despair, you’ve got to look after yourself. Most people turned to alcohol or drugs or eating terribly, or, you know, one night stands, or you know, they sabotage themselves more because they’re trying to avoid the pain. Whereas in fact, the best thing you could do is make sure you have greens with every meal, or go for a walk on the beach, or say three things you’re grateful for. Even in the moments of despair, you can be grateful, the sunshine or you can be grateful your cat’s looking at you can be grateful. Your mom told you, she loved you. There’s there’s always something to be grateful for. And I said to Jacob, can you do that? And he said, yeah. And I said, and you promised me was self care. And being an aroma therapist, I’m going to run you bass every night, that I’m going to put oils in there to help with your muscles. I didn’t say to help your hormones and your brain and your mind. But you know, to help your muscles and he said, Yeah, I’ll do it. And I see. But Jacob, the third step is the biggest and the most important one of all, and that self discipline, because you cannot have self love. Without discipline, you cannot be a beautiful pregnant woman without discipline of looking after yourself. You can’t be a before and after photo, unless you look after yourself, and show the discipline to do the skills. You can’t get a degree unless you show discipline. You can’t stick to a weight loss program. Without discipline, you can’t get it. You can’t do anything without discipline, it takes us You can’t love yourself without discipline, to be honest, it takes discipline. And I see So Jacob, I’m going to ask you to not swear at a teacher for the next 28 days, you’re going to have to go down to the beach twice a week, we’re lucky we live by the beach twice a week barefoot and just wet run the beach, you’re 16 you got to train. And you also have to know with discipline that if you do make a mistake or swear at a teacher, then you just got to go back to step one, which is a witness, you’ve made a mistake and apologize for it, own it, and then step back into self care. So to me those first three steps are doing you have to do something, you can’t just sit back and hope life gets better. But with that comes the next step, which is self control. Now, some people might say self control is to control the outcome. There’s no such thing as controlling anything. The only thing I have control over is my behavior. And my even that I don’t even have control over sometimes. So what I mean by self control is you have more awareness around how you control your behavior, your thoughts, your feelings, and with self control. You it means if you’re about to go and swear at somebody, you actually have built a discipline around not needing to or wanting to blink to someone that they shouldn’t eat gluten free, actually, with discernment and more control. It’s their journey, not yours. So I talked to him about the power, I believe Even self control is magnificent. Because once you start feeling what it is to have control about the way you act and behave, that it’s real, true love. And then the next step, when we have control, more self control, we have more self respect. And when we respect ourselves, there’s no way you’re going to put people down or there’s no way you’re going to be nasty to yourself, put crap into your body or not go for a walk on the beach, or say nasty things. And I looked at my daughter, and she said, Actually, I said, What do you think of self respect, and she said, self respect, I think is when you say nice things about people when you don’t get drawn into gossip, when you don’t put people down when you don’t judge self respect to me, ma’am, is when you actually love who you are so much that you won’t do anything to hurt it. I thought, and I put that in the book because I thought she nailed it. And when we have self respect, there’s a word in New Zealand a Maori word could Manor. And that is a true real power self power mana is to really own who you are, man is to trust in the God in you, and to believe in the God and others. And it’s just so powerful. That word, I can’t even articulate it. But it’s such a powerful word. And then when we have self respect, the last step in my six step process is self acceptance. And that means we can accept ourselves warts and all the good and the not so good, the shadow and the light. The times when we know life sucks. And the times when we know, I know, there’s times I’ve been an amazing mother. And I know there’s times when I’ve been a dreadful mother, and to own both parts of me. And that is to own myself wholeheartedly and to love myself. And I looked at Jacob and I said, I think that’s the six steps to self love. And he looked at me and he said, Ma’am, I’ve never had anyone explain it to me like this before, you’ve got to write a book. And Danny had tears rolling down his face. And he said, that’s what I needed four years ago. And I thought you two other reason, I’m going to write this book. So that’s how
I had no idea. That’s amazing. That is so amazing that from your own frustrations of pain with with seniors, your son goes through where it is that you’re able to take something and turn it into that’s just beautiful. And golden is gonna help so many other people from doing that, as opposed to it impacting you in the negative, obviously, it’s impacting you, but to take it on board in a different way, you’re still able to see this challenge and grow from it and help others which is just phenomenal. I just hope all the females listening to this show will hopefully pass this podcast on to their partners to have a listen. And hopefully that will land. Because for me personally, I have needed a framework and structure and something to start to see the dots as opposed to just feel my way through in some respects, because otherwise it just doesn’t land it doesn’t get through for especially as men, you know?
Jacob confirmed it for me when he said that explanation just and it and of course, you know, life can be ticking along and all sudden you get a phone call at four o’clock in the morning, and all of a sudden you’re back and out of the circle of self love. You think life sucks and everything’s bad. But you’ve got this model to step back at first step is awareness, awareness. I know it’s not great, I’ve got to take care of myself, Oh my gosh, it takes discipline to do that. And with that I’m more controlled with the work, I can’t control what’s happened, but I can control my reaction. I’m going to respect myself wholeheartedly and love the people I love even more and accept that there are some things I cannot change. But I can certainly become a better version of myself in spite of it.
Yeah, beautiful. Fantastic. I think I think about because with frameworks, if you stick them on your fridge, where you see them somewhere you’re aware, the awareness The first step is to speak about there’s a challenge happening, there’s something going on, you can actually refer to a framework and work your way through it yourself. Right, okay. Because you we tend to know once we become aware, we tend to know what’s the right thing to do. Whether we do it or not is another thing.
Well also the you know, when it comes down to the physiology, the brain itself has a whole lot of neuroplasticity and and these amazing neurochemical loops, that for years you may have said I’m a failure. People have told you you’re a failure, you failed at things. So you’ve got this very strongly wired connection for failure. But if you take on those steps, it’s never about eradicating that I’m a failure. It’s just that you’ll create stronger neurochemical connections that override them whenever they show up. So I’m never about hiding from yourself or losing who you are, or pretending you were never that because that’s what makes the tapestry of your life so beautiful, is all the colors and the shades and the grays and the darks and then all the rainbows that come with it. And I think you’d agree with me it wouldn’t matter how old you are, what shape you are, what I color, how little or how much he you have. When you meet someone that has a spark in their eye. That’s true beauty. That’s true love and It’s never about aging which is probably why I got so passionate about having a skincare company and aroma therapy company because I’m not about you know, aging with no wrinkles I’m in my 50s now there’s there’s many more wrinkles coming. But I look at them and I think of them as stripes of honor and my stretch marks for you know, I had two babies that there are women out there craving, they’re paying fortune to get those stretch marks How do I knock my stretch marks when there’s women who would give anything for it? How do I knock my brace that are getting more and more saggy? You know, as I get older, and they feed to babies, you know, they they have been an incredible part of me. And there’s women out there have had to have these removed had dear, I knock my breasts when anyone would give anything for them. You know, I’ve just really learned that the art of acknowledging what I’ve got been respectful for what I have, because in a moment, it could be taken away.
Beautiful. I love it. I love it. I’m going to ask you a few questions and ask everyone on the show before we wrap it up. And one is what is your morning routine look like?
Oh, I very big on rituals, you know, with oils, I love my rituals. I do love a morning coffee. I do love that. So I will do that I do my meditation I sometimes my meditation By the way, when life’s busy, and especially my children were young, it could be a 32nd meditation, the key is not to miss it. So it’s just being mindful and sitting quietly for 10 2030 seconds, I took that off as a as a well done, on the days that I’m challenged, or it can be up to 20 minutes, I’ve learnt Transcendental Meditation. So I love doing 20 minutes twice a day. And I love my walk or gym or Pilates or a run. So I’ll always do some form of movement. And sometimes on the days that I’m not feeling it, and I just haven’t got the energy, I’ll do what I call my fab four and five, which is four exercises done in five minutes. So to me, you’re better off doing a little bit of something than nothing at all. So my fab four and five is just 10 setups, 10 Press ups, 10 tricep dips and 10 squats, if I just if that’s all I get done for the day, I take that off as well. And then I will have my air medic shower. So I will take my loofa or my body brush with a couple of drops of my favorite oils into the bath into the shower and I will body brush because I know that’s great for my lymphatics and my skin, then I hop out and there’s a ritual I’ve never missed in 32 years ever. It’s a call at my body boost ritual. And it takes me 30 seconds, I put three drops of my favorite essential oil blend into my cream or oil, some magnesium, I pet it onto my body. And then I rub my whole body from toes to head. And when I finish, I say one thing I’m grateful for. And on my website, there’s a free manifesto you can download. And that’s got four pages of positive things you can say, and I’ve got them up on my window up on my mirror so that if I ever forget or if I’m in a bad place, there’s always something nice to say. And I’ll take a deep breath. And then I come out I don’t always feel like breakfast. I’ve realized as I get older, sometimes I like to intermittently fast all the way through to 1112 o’clock. I try to listen to my body, the older I get. And sometimes that’s why I’m really trusting. Now going for a five or 10 k run isn’t always the best thing for me sometimes being quiet and doing just gentle stretching is the best thing for me. So sometimes I’ll have breakfast, or I get straight into my work. But lately, since I’ve graduated as a hypnotherapist, and I’ve been doing my NLP, I have really set a really strike before I sit down. Like even before we did this podcast, everything I do now has a strong intention. What’s my intention? So my intention before this podcast was that I get interviewed by an amazing soul who brings out the best in me, that allows me to be the conduit for messages for people that somehow someway will hear something for them. So that was my intention before this podcast. And so everything I do now I set an intention. And my gosh, I’ve been achieving so much more. With that simple intention. I’m going to be a great mom today when I drove down to Brisbane to take my son to the chiropractor the other day. He’s 21 Now, by the way, and he is phenomenal. And he’s still a bread sometimes, but I still love him and my daughter is still cheeky and naughty, but they’re just adorable. And you know, I set the intention of being the best mama and I say to them, you’re gonna have to get used to the fact that you don’t live with me anymore. So be prepared to be less less, you know, smothered and kisses and be told how much I adore you. And I will still tell you I think you’ve taken too many cute pills and I will still tell you you’re the most amazing daughter and the most amazing son so you have to you know so I do all these sorts of things but intention to me has become a really powerful new ritual that I’ve brought on to my day for the last probably six weeks
Amazing, How can you not have an amazing day after morning like that?
I see. That’s no joke that is and sometimes it’s very quick. So don’t get me wrong. It’s not having hours because one of the biggest things I’ve learned through all the women that I’ve taught through my life Is that There’s always time and money their two base excuses why they can’t do something. So I’ve taken all of that away. And I’ll always it’s never about time and money. It’s whether or not you choose to make it a priority. That’s all
massive. And look, I’m intention is huge for me. It’s massive. It’s something I’ve carried with me for a long time and thought about on a daily weekly and a longer basis. What’s my intention of these moments in his days? And it’s like he’s like you say it’s a game changer. I really think we we have so much scattered awareness and scattered energy. And we don’t clarify what it is our intent behind something. And I think we can forget about how powerful that is. I’m so glad you said that. That’s amazing. And hypnotherapist? I had no idea. You’ve shocked me so many times today are amazing. I should say not shocked. amazed. Absolutely. What’s one thing about yourself most people wouldn’t know about.
I’ve got a tattoo on my butt. I got it for my 40th birthday. There’s two. There you go. Oh, that shocked you? Yeah,
that’s perfectly but may ask what they are. Oh, is that one is
the Celtic symbol for anam cara, which means soul friend. And my girlfriend and I, when we, you know moved countries, we both said what’s something we could do that will always remind each other and we do believe we’re each other’s. anam cara, which means soul friend. And it’s the most beautiful and we I’ve got Celtic tradition, you know, heritage. And I put that beautiful emblem on my path. And then I also because I ran for Australia, I couldn’t quite put a kangaroo or koala. By habit. But because I’m a kiwi, I put the silver fin on there as well.
Amazing. That was not what I was expecting. Probably the best answer I’ve had on the podcast. Last question, if you could have dinner with someone from any timeframe anywhere in the world that’s inspired you emitted an impact in your life. Who do you think it would be? And why?
Do you know I’ve often thought about it. You know, there’s so many celebrities, I always thought someone like Madonna when I was young would be someone I’d love to sit and have a chat with. But the older I get, the more I realize, seeing my children get older and listening to their view on the world and having opinions now at 22 and 21. I am fascinated by them. And also, you know, people that maybe aren’t celebrities, people that have gone through challenges people, the everyday person who listens to our podcasts, the who aren’t just everyday people, their extraordinary everyday people. But to sit there and listen to people’s stories has been one of the most inspirational thing I’ve ever been a part of so to be, I can’t say a name. But if one of your listeners turned around and said to me, you know that they had a story I would give anything to have dinner with that person to hear this story. I honestly do.
Beautiful, absolutely beautiful. Last question. With everything we’ve covered today. Is there anything you’d like to leave our listeners to ponder on?
There’s…there’s a quote that I say a lot. And I think it’s quite poignant to share it here. And you know, when I’ve talked a lot about the light and the dark, and that it’s that the contrast of life but if you can understand that the best way you can. The best gift you can give this planet is your love and your happiness and your extraordinariness, which is a new word. But this quote is perfect for there. If there is light in the soul, there is beauty in the person. If there is beauty in the person, there is harmony in the home. If there is harmony in the home, there is order in the nation. If there is order in the nation, there’s peace in this world.
How awesome is that? Isn’t it? That’s it. That’s you know, I just want to say something about to that I think for everyone, and I’m sure you’d like to add before we wrap it up, but with everything that’s going on in the world right now. And we can get so overwhelmed and caught up and like what do we do? You know, for me, it’s always come back to the self, how can I improve? What can I do to myself today to be just a little bit better than I was yesterday, and the ripple effect moves on? I’ve never heard that quote before. I think
it’s a lovely quote, lovely proverb Chinese proverb, it’s just yeah speaks volumes, doesn’t it? Which comes back to it comes back to us, shine our light. And that ripples out into our beautiful community and our family.
Amazing, Kim, what a way to end it. Where Where can we send everyone to you? where’s the best place to follow? You will have links in the show notes anyway. But yeah, if they want to learn more about you,
My Facebook. Yes?
I was gonna say I don’t forget your podcast recently as well. I’ll make sure that’s Linked in.
I feel very privileged. I was on a podcast show for seven years with Cindy O’Meara and Karen Smith on up for a chat. And then we’ve decided that came to a close at the end of last year and this year, I started up the self love podcast, which You can find on the wellnesscouch.com, or any of the beautiful platforms. And but my Facebook page is Kim Morrison training where you’ll find that’s my business page, my, my, my face page. And then I love Instagram, which is Kim Morrison and then the number 28. My business is 20 eight.com the word 20 in the number eight.com. And the thing that I launched just before COVID hit was my self love and wellness Mentorship Program, which is an evergreen program that you can come in at monthly or annual. And we just do weekly, I coach every week, every Tuesday night, all pre recorded and we have beautiful guests and master classes and really do learn the art of self love. And that’s at Kim Morrison training.com.
Kim, amazing. Thank you so much for sharing everything on your show today. You speak so openly from the heart and I have no doubt you inspire many, including myself as well. So thanks for that you do and like being a guest today. I really appreciate it.
Thank you and I just want to say thank you for being a guest on my podcast. It’s been one of the biggest hits of my show. It was privileged to interview and here we are, cannot say thanks enough
Amazing Thank you Kim. Thank you